In this episode of People Play Story, host Martin Kloss delves into the art of minimalist presentations, inspired by his book, "People Play Story." Kloss emphasizes the power of a bare stage, suggesting that stripping away visual clutter allows the message to truly resonate with the audience. He discusses the concept of "information bias," where more content can actually detract from the core message, and shares personal anecdotes of successful slide-free presentations that fostered deeper audience engagement. Kloss also highlights the importance of being present and vulnerable on stage, drawing parallels to the captivating nature of TED Talks.
The conversation further explores practical tips for enhancing presentation delivery, such as using note cards as memory triggers rather than scripts, and the strategic use of PowerPoint. Kloss advocates for visuals that complement rather than overshadow the speaker, and suggests innovative slide categories to break free from traditional formats. He also touches on the significance of delivery order, encouraging presenters to experiment with visual and verbal cues to maximize impact. Ultimately, Kloss inspires listeners to embrace simplicity, focus on connection, and let their message shine.
[00:00:08]
Martin Kloss:
Hi, and welcome to People Play Story, a podcast about storytelling and how to communicate with impact. My name is Martin Kloss, and I'm a professional story coach and speaker trainer. I recently wrote a book. It's called People Play Story, but it's only available in German for now. So to help me reach a wider audience and spread the word about the power of stories, I created this podcast. Full disclosure, what you're about to hear is generated by an AI, courtesy of Google's notebook LM. And each episode is based on a different chapter of my book. I hope you enjoy it and that I can give you something to think about today.
Have fun.
[00:00:53] Unknown:
Alright. So, you're looking to really nail your stage presence, and dish all the, the usual stuff we rely on, embrace that less is more idea.
[00:01:05] Unknown:
Sounds like we're diving into Martin Kloss's people play story today. Ew. Specifically, those tools and play sections. Right? You got it. And, you know, one of the most intriguing things Kloss suggests is that the best presentations,
[00:01:16] Unknown:
well, they might have almost nothing on stage. Woah. Really? Like, he's talking about his completely bare stage. No props, no nothing, not even holding on to a clicker. Exactly. He's getting at this idea of just being present, you know, vulnerable with the audience. That's well, that's kinda intimidating when you think about it. Mhmm. I mean, I know I feel naked on stage without my notes and slides. Right. And it makes you wonder, like, have there been times where all the tech, the slides actually made it harder to pay attention? Oh, totally. It's like my brain can only handle so much visual input at once. Too many things going on, and I completely tune out the speaker. It's true. It's like our brains crave more, more, more.
[00:01:55] Unknown:
Kloss calls it information bias. We assume more stuff equals a better message, but it often backfires. Each extra thing is just another distraction.
[00:02:04] Unknown:
So when you strip it all back, your message actually has space to land. I get that. It's like walking into one of those super minimalist well designed rooms. You can appreciate the little things because there's no visual clutter. Yeah. You know? It's impactful in a different way. Great analogy. And think about TED Talks. Right? Known for being captivating.
[00:02:22] Unknown:
A limited time, bare stage, all eyes on the speaker. So true. You find yourself hanging on there every word because there's nothing to distract you. Have you ever, like, tried that minimalist approach yourself? You know, I have. I remember this one presentation. It was at a conference. I went completely slide free. Woah. Brave. How'd that go over? Honestly, one of my most engaging presentations ever. Since I wasn't glued to slides, I connected with the audience more, riffed off their questions, even got into some storytelling. Yeah. It's amazing. Yeah. So we're seeing the power of the empty stage, even if it's metaphorical.
[00:02:55] Unknown:
Right. Yeah. But what about the tools we do need sometimes?
[00:02:59] Unknown:
Like, Klaus had some funny observations about clickers. Oh, absolutely. He was saying how a clicker can become this, like, weird extension of the speaker Yeah. Waving it around, cradling it. Yeah. I've totally been there. I get a little attached to my clicker sometimes. It's like a comfort blanket. It's funny, but it proves a point. Right? Even something small, it becomes a distraction. Close as anything out of the ordinary, grabs the audience's attention. So even if we're used to clickers, the audience is thinking, what is that? And boom, their focus is gone. Okay. So ditch the clicker entirely. Is that what he's saying? Not necessarily. It's more about being intentional. He suggests minimizing clicks only when really needed or even having a separate clicker person or presentation that runs itself. It's about recognizing every little thing has an impact. Right. I've actually messed around with self running presentations for webinars.
[00:03:50] Unknown:
Timing takes practice to get right, but when it works, it's awesome. You can really focus on your delivery. Totally. And it comes down to this question. When you're using tech in your presentations,
[00:03:59] Unknown:
what message are you really sending? Is it adding to the message or taking away from you, the speaker? Yeah. It's like every little thing matters, even if we don't realize it consciously.
[00:04:10] Unknown:
Speaking of things that make you feel prepared, what about note cards? I bet some people listening are right there with us, note cards in hand. Ah, the note card dilemma.
[00:04:18] Unknown:
And Kloss gets it. You know? They make you feel safe, prepared, like a safety net when you're up there. But he also warns about becoming what he calls a manuscript martyr, glued to the cards, just reading.
[00:04:31] Unknown:
Ugh. Yeah. I've been there. So much practice with the note cards that you end up sounding like a robot on
[00:04:37] Unknown:
stage. Not exactly captivating. The opposite of what we want. Right. He actually suggests thinking of them as, like, triggers, little reminders of the big idea, not the whole script. He even has specific formatting tips to make them easier to glance at.
[00:04:50] Unknown:
You know. Okay. Now you have my attention. Tell me more. What kind of formatting are we talking about? Well, he loves sans serif fonts. Something clean, easy on the eyes like Helvetica,
[00:04:58] Unknown:
and big enough to actually see at least 18 font, he suggests, so you're not squinting under the stage lights.
[00:05:05] Unknown:
You know, I think I'm already on the same page as Kloss here. I've been going with a similar font size lately, even color coding my keywords just to make them pop. See? Ahead of the game. It's all about that clarity, even on your note cards. And he's big on keywords over full sentences,
[00:05:20] Unknown:
just enough to jog your memory, not tempt you to read verbatim. Oh, and his rule of three, never more than three key points max per card. Okay. The rule of three I can get behind. Makes total sense. Our brains love things in threes. Though, gotta admit, I'm still kinda old school. I like the feel of paper note cards. What's Clauss' take on that? Well, for the eco conscious presenter, he's all about the Kindle. Ditches the paper completely. Wait. Really? The Kindle for presentations? That's wild. Right. But hear him out. He raves about the matte display, says it's surprisingly easy to read even under harsh spotlights. Plus, you can edit on the fly and no more last minute scribbles in the margins.
And, well, the environmental aspect is a big plus for him. You know, I can see the appeal.
[00:06:05] Unknown:
Not sure I'm ready to give up my beloved index cards entirely, but a digital backup,
[00:06:09] Unknown:
that's an idea. A safety net for your safety net. I like that. And, hey, speaking of digital, I think it's time we talk about the elephant in the room presentation wise, PowerPoint.
[00:06:19] Unknown:
We've all been there. Death by PowerPoint, you called it. So where does it fit into this whole minimalist approach, friend or foe? Right. It's practically unavoidable these days, but we've all sat through those presentations. You know the ones where the slides are more distracting than helpful. It really is inescapable, isn't it? PowerPoint, I mean, it's like the default setting for presentations. Yeah. But I do love this idea of, like, questioning that default. Is there a better way? Is PowerPoint
[00:06:43] Unknown:
really our only option? And that's the thing. Clauses Point isn't to demonize PowerPoint. It's more about how do we use it well because bad PowerPoint. We've all been there. Oh, absolutely. It's about being strategic. Using it to, like, elevate your message, not bury it in bullet points. Exactly. The biggest trap is becoming a slave to your slides. You know? Reading straight from them, you become a narrator instead of the presenter.
[00:07:09] Unknown:
Ugh. The worst. You could practically feel the audience tuning out, eyes glazing over. It's painful.
[00:07:15] Unknown:
The opposite of what we want. He emphasizes, like, we are the main event, not the slides. They should be support, not the star of the show. So it's like PowerPoint, you're great and all, but I'm running this presentation. Exactly. Once you realize that, the choices you make about those slides, they change. Kloss is big on using visuals the right way, not defaulting to bullet points, but actually showing information instead of just using text. It's that show, don't tell idea. Oh, yeah. Right. Can you give an example of how that works in a presentation? Sure. Like, let's say your topic is teamwork. Right? Instead of listing the benefits, what if you have a powerful image, a team really doing something together collaboratively? Or with data, instead of boring chart, find a visual metaphor that makes that data interesting. He says, ask yourself, can a picture replace these words? It's about creating an experience, not just an info dump. I like that. Right. And when you do use text, make it count.
One impactful quote, well displayed, will stick with people more than a slide crammed with words. Kloss is all about that. Less is more. Right? It's like they say, a picture's worth a thousand words.
[00:08:21] Unknown:
Or in this case, a good image and a killer, quote,
[00:08:24] Unknown:
beat a thousand bullet points. Now you're getting it. And to make things even more visually interesting, Kloss says, we gotta think outside the typical slide deck formula. You know, title, content, thank you, the end. There are categories of slides that can mix things up. Oh, yes. Give me those categories. How do we escape the PowerPoint rut? He talks about openings and closings, first and last impressions, those matter. Instead of a boring title slide, what if it's a big thought provoking question about your topic or ending on a powerful call to action? I love that. It's like you're inviting the audience into a dialogue right away, and that call to action at the end gives them something to actually use. Exactly. Then there's content slides where he's a huge fan of white space, like, in design. Yeah. Sometimes the most impactful stuff needs room to breathe. Less clutter, more impact. Right. And then you've got highlight and repeat slides. You bring back a key theme, a visual echo to really make it stick. Love it. And lastly, don't underestimate
[00:09:22] Unknown:
transitions and blank slides. They create pauses. You know? Let the audience reset, refocus on you, the speaker, all that information overload. This is like hitting the pause button. It's so true. We forget to do that. Yeah. Build in those moments to breathe just like in music or a movie. Those moments of silence can be so powerful. Exactly. We're so busy delivering that we forget to let the audience actually absorb anything. Man, this has been eye opening. From the empty stage to PowerPoint makeovers, what a ride. But before we wrap up, what's, like, the biggest takeaway Kluss leaves us with? He wants us to be more aware of how we present, not just the content,
[00:09:57] Unknown:
but the delivery itself. How does that change the way people hear our message? I'm ready to be more aware. Tell me more about this delivery aspect. Well, he says our brains have a preference for the order of information. Visual then verbal, or the other way around. And it's worth playing with both, seeing what your audience responds to. So, like, showing an image before I talk about it versus after, that makes a difference. Exactly. You can build anticipation with words, then reveal the image, or hit them with the visual, let it sink in, then explain. It's like the order you add ingredients when you're cooking, you know, changes the whole flavor. Love that analogy. It's not just what we say, but the order we say it in. That's wild. It is. And the fun part is you can watch your audience, see what works better, become a student of your own presentations. A communication scientist,
[00:10:45] Unknown:
testing, experimenting,
[00:10:46] Unknown:
seeing what data we get paid. Exactly. And that's what it's all about. Right? Being more intentional, more willing to play around, remembering it's not just about info, it's about connection,
[00:10:55] Unknown:
leaving them with something that matters. This deep dive has been fantastic. So to everyone listening, ready to ditch the crutches, embrace less is more. What's the one thing to remember? You are your own best tool. Seriously, don't be afraid of the pause of keeping it simple. Strip away the distractions. Let your message be the star. So as you prep that next big presentation, remember what we've learned from Kloss. Embrace the empty stage, metaphorically or literally. Lose the distractions, connect with your people, and watch the impact happen. Oh, and have fun. Can't forget that. Never. Until next time, everybody. Happy presenting.
[00:11:42] Martin Kloss:
Hi everyone. It's me again. Just a quick note before I let you go. I hope you found today's episode entertaining, engaging and maybe even inspiring. If you did, please spread the word. And if you didn't, please keep it to yourself. And if you wanna know more, have any questions, or wanna work with me, please get in touch with me on martin klaus dot com or on LinkedIn. Now have a great day. Go out and do something fun.
Hi, and welcome to People Play Story, a podcast about storytelling and how to communicate with impact. My name is Martin Kloss, and I'm a professional story coach and speaker trainer. I recently wrote a book. It's called People Play Story, but it's only available in German for now. So to help me reach a wider audience and spread the word about the power of stories, I created this podcast. Full disclosure, what you're about to hear is generated by an AI, courtesy of Google's notebook LM. And each episode is based on a different chapter of my book. I hope you enjoy it and that I can give you something to think about today.
Have fun.
[00:00:53] Unknown:
Alright. So, you're looking to really nail your stage presence, and dish all the, the usual stuff we rely on, embrace that less is more idea.
[00:01:05] Unknown:
Sounds like we're diving into Martin Kloss's people play story today. Ew. Specifically, those tools and play sections. Right? You got it. And, you know, one of the most intriguing things Kloss suggests is that the best presentations,
[00:01:16] Unknown:
well, they might have almost nothing on stage. Woah. Really? Like, he's talking about his completely bare stage. No props, no nothing, not even holding on to a clicker. Exactly. He's getting at this idea of just being present, you know, vulnerable with the audience. That's well, that's kinda intimidating when you think about it. Mhmm. I mean, I know I feel naked on stage without my notes and slides. Right. And it makes you wonder, like, have there been times where all the tech, the slides actually made it harder to pay attention? Oh, totally. It's like my brain can only handle so much visual input at once. Too many things going on, and I completely tune out the speaker. It's true. It's like our brains crave more, more, more.
[00:01:55] Unknown:
Kloss calls it information bias. We assume more stuff equals a better message, but it often backfires. Each extra thing is just another distraction.
[00:02:04] Unknown:
So when you strip it all back, your message actually has space to land. I get that. It's like walking into one of those super minimalist well designed rooms. You can appreciate the little things because there's no visual clutter. Yeah. You know? It's impactful in a different way. Great analogy. And think about TED Talks. Right? Known for being captivating.
[00:02:22] Unknown:
A limited time, bare stage, all eyes on the speaker. So true. You find yourself hanging on there every word because there's nothing to distract you. Have you ever, like, tried that minimalist approach yourself? You know, I have. I remember this one presentation. It was at a conference. I went completely slide free. Woah. Brave. How'd that go over? Honestly, one of my most engaging presentations ever. Since I wasn't glued to slides, I connected with the audience more, riffed off their questions, even got into some storytelling. Yeah. It's amazing. Yeah. So we're seeing the power of the empty stage, even if it's metaphorical.
[00:02:55] Unknown:
Right. Yeah. But what about the tools we do need sometimes?
[00:02:59] Unknown:
Like, Klaus had some funny observations about clickers. Oh, absolutely. He was saying how a clicker can become this, like, weird extension of the speaker Yeah. Waving it around, cradling it. Yeah. I've totally been there. I get a little attached to my clicker sometimes. It's like a comfort blanket. It's funny, but it proves a point. Right? Even something small, it becomes a distraction. Close as anything out of the ordinary, grabs the audience's attention. So even if we're used to clickers, the audience is thinking, what is that? And boom, their focus is gone. Okay. So ditch the clicker entirely. Is that what he's saying? Not necessarily. It's more about being intentional. He suggests minimizing clicks only when really needed or even having a separate clicker person or presentation that runs itself. It's about recognizing every little thing has an impact. Right. I've actually messed around with self running presentations for webinars.
[00:03:50] Unknown:
Timing takes practice to get right, but when it works, it's awesome. You can really focus on your delivery. Totally. And it comes down to this question. When you're using tech in your presentations,
[00:03:59] Unknown:
what message are you really sending? Is it adding to the message or taking away from you, the speaker? Yeah. It's like every little thing matters, even if we don't realize it consciously.
[00:04:10] Unknown:
Speaking of things that make you feel prepared, what about note cards? I bet some people listening are right there with us, note cards in hand. Ah, the note card dilemma.
[00:04:18] Unknown:
And Kloss gets it. You know? They make you feel safe, prepared, like a safety net when you're up there. But he also warns about becoming what he calls a manuscript martyr, glued to the cards, just reading.
[00:04:31] Unknown:
Ugh. Yeah. I've been there. So much practice with the note cards that you end up sounding like a robot on
[00:04:37] Unknown:
stage. Not exactly captivating. The opposite of what we want. Right. He actually suggests thinking of them as, like, triggers, little reminders of the big idea, not the whole script. He even has specific formatting tips to make them easier to glance at.
[00:04:50] Unknown:
You know. Okay. Now you have my attention. Tell me more. What kind of formatting are we talking about? Well, he loves sans serif fonts. Something clean, easy on the eyes like Helvetica,
[00:04:58] Unknown:
and big enough to actually see at least 18 font, he suggests, so you're not squinting under the stage lights.
[00:05:05] Unknown:
You know, I think I'm already on the same page as Kloss here. I've been going with a similar font size lately, even color coding my keywords just to make them pop. See? Ahead of the game. It's all about that clarity, even on your note cards. And he's big on keywords over full sentences,
[00:05:20] Unknown:
just enough to jog your memory, not tempt you to read verbatim. Oh, and his rule of three, never more than three key points max per card. Okay. The rule of three I can get behind. Makes total sense. Our brains love things in threes. Though, gotta admit, I'm still kinda old school. I like the feel of paper note cards. What's Clauss' take on that? Well, for the eco conscious presenter, he's all about the Kindle. Ditches the paper completely. Wait. Really? The Kindle for presentations? That's wild. Right. But hear him out. He raves about the matte display, says it's surprisingly easy to read even under harsh spotlights. Plus, you can edit on the fly and no more last minute scribbles in the margins.
And, well, the environmental aspect is a big plus for him. You know, I can see the appeal.
[00:06:05] Unknown:
Not sure I'm ready to give up my beloved index cards entirely, but a digital backup,
[00:06:09] Unknown:
that's an idea. A safety net for your safety net. I like that. And, hey, speaking of digital, I think it's time we talk about the elephant in the room presentation wise, PowerPoint.
[00:06:19] Unknown:
We've all been there. Death by PowerPoint, you called it. So where does it fit into this whole minimalist approach, friend or foe? Right. It's practically unavoidable these days, but we've all sat through those presentations. You know the ones where the slides are more distracting than helpful. It really is inescapable, isn't it? PowerPoint, I mean, it's like the default setting for presentations. Yeah. But I do love this idea of, like, questioning that default. Is there a better way? Is PowerPoint
[00:06:43] Unknown:
really our only option? And that's the thing. Clauses Point isn't to demonize PowerPoint. It's more about how do we use it well because bad PowerPoint. We've all been there. Oh, absolutely. It's about being strategic. Using it to, like, elevate your message, not bury it in bullet points. Exactly. The biggest trap is becoming a slave to your slides. You know? Reading straight from them, you become a narrator instead of the presenter.
[00:07:09] Unknown:
Ugh. The worst. You could practically feel the audience tuning out, eyes glazing over. It's painful.
[00:07:15] Unknown:
The opposite of what we want. He emphasizes, like, we are the main event, not the slides. They should be support, not the star of the show. So it's like PowerPoint, you're great and all, but I'm running this presentation. Exactly. Once you realize that, the choices you make about those slides, they change. Kloss is big on using visuals the right way, not defaulting to bullet points, but actually showing information instead of just using text. It's that show, don't tell idea. Oh, yeah. Right. Can you give an example of how that works in a presentation? Sure. Like, let's say your topic is teamwork. Right? Instead of listing the benefits, what if you have a powerful image, a team really doing something together collaboratively? Or with data, instead of boring chart, find a visual metaphor that makes that data interesting. He says, ask yourself, can a picture replace these words? It's about creating an experience, not just an info dump. I like that. Right. And when you do use text, make it count.
One impactful quote, well displayed, will stick with people more than a slide crammed with words. Kloss is all about that. Less is more. Right? It's like they say, a picture's worth a thousand words.
[00:08:21] Unknown:
Or in this case, a good image and a killer, quote,
[00:08:24] Unknown:
beat a thousand bullet points. Now you're getting it. And to make things even more visually interesting, Kloss says, we gotta think outside the typical slide deck formula. You know, title, content, thank you, the end. There are categories of slides that can mix things up. Oh, yes. Give me those categories. How do we escape the PowerPoint rut? He talks about openings and closings, first and last impressions, those matter. Instead of a boring title slide, what if it's a big thought provoking question about your topic or ending on a powerful call to action? I love that. It's like you're inviting the audience into a dialogue right away, and that call to action at the end gives them something to actually use. Exactly. Then there's content slides where he's a huge fan of white space, like, in design. Yeah. Sometimes the most impactful stuff needs room to breathe. Less clutter, more impact. Right. And then you've got highlight and repeat slides. You bring back a key theme, a visual echo to really make it stick. Love it. And lastly, don't underestimate
[00:09:22] Unknown:
transitions and blank slides. They create pauses. You know? Let the audience reset, refocus on you, the speaker, all that information overload. This is like hitting the pause button. It's so true. We forget to do that. Yeah. Build in those moments to breathe just like in music or a movie. Those moments of silence can be so powerful. Exactly. We're so busy delivering that we forget to let the audience actually absorb anything. Man, this has been eye opening. From the empty stage to PowerPoint makeovers, what a ride. But before we wrap up, what's, like, the biggest takeaway Kluss leaves us with? He wants us to be more aware of how we present, not just the content,
[00:09:57] Unknown:
but the delivery itself. How does that change the way people hear our message? I'm ready to be more aware. Tell me more about this delivery aspect. Well, he says our brains have a preference for the order of information. Visual then verbal, or the other way around. And it's worth playing with both, seeing what your audience responds to. So, like, showing an image before I talk about it versus after, that makes a difference. Exactly. You can build anticipation with words, then reveal the image, or hit them with the visual, let it sink in, then explain. It's like the order you add ingredients when you're cooking, you know, changes the whole flavor. Love that analogy. It's not just what we say, but the order we say it in. That's wild. It is. And the fun part is you can watch your audience, see what works better, become a student of your own presentations. A communication scientist,
[00:10:45] Unknown:
testing, experimenting,
[00:10:46] Unknown:
seeing what data we get paid. Exactly. And that's what it's all about. Right? Being more intentional, more willing to play around, remembering it's not just about info, it's about connection,
[00:10:55] Unknown:
leaving them with something that matters. This deep dive has been fantastic. So to everyone listening, ready to ditch the crutches, embrace less is more. What's the one thing to remember? You are your own best tool. Seriously, don't be afraid of the pause of keeping it simple. Strip away the distractions. Let your message be the star. So as you prep that next big presentation, remember what we've learned from Kloss. Embrace the empty stage, metaphorically or literally. Lose the distractions, connect with your people, and watch the impact happen. Oh, and have fun. Can't forget that. Never. Until next time, everybody. Happy presenting.
[00:11:42] Martin Kloss:
Hi everyone. It's me again. Just a quick note before I let you go. I hope you found today's episode entertaining, engaging and maybe even inspiring. If you did, please spread the word. And if you didn't, please keep it to yourself. And if you wanna know more, have any questions, or wanna work with me, please get in touch with me on martin klaus dot com or on LinkedIn. Now have a great day. Go out and do something fun.
